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Old Twistie Sticks Rider
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5,072 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I had posted about the bad tire wear I got from my Dunlop 404 rear tire, the one I had to replace at 2,402 mi. that was as slick as a new spanked babies hind end, and should have been replaced at 18-1900 mi. if replaced as recommended...
Well just to show that it was not me, or the bike, here is its replacement (Michelin) at 3,500 mi., and it looks like it will go for several thousand more to me...



Kinda assures me that the 404 I got was indeed a piece of crap as I thought...
Have a good one...Old Dog...
 

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Premium Member
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5,236 Posts
I had posted about the bad tire wear I got from my Dunlop 404 rear tire, the one I had to replace at 2,402 mi. that was as slick as a new spanked babies hind end, and should have been replaced at 18-1900 mi. if replaced as recommended...
Well just to show that it was not me, or the bike, here is its replacement (Michelin) at 3,500 mi., and it looks like it will go for several thousand more to me...



Kinda assures me that the 404 I got was indeed a piece of crap as I thought...
Have a good one...Old Dog...
I will back you up on that,I put 2 ,404 Dunlops on mine last spring and got about 2200 miles out of the set.

I out a set of Dunlop Elite 3 tires on it next and I am still running on both of them.The 404 is just too soft for any but the lightest of bikes and a rathewr conservative rider along with it.
The E3 Dunlops cost about the same as the HD Branded Dunlop which is also a much better wearing tire too.

When it comes to wear and tire life along with price considered,the 404 is just not a good buy.You will go through about 3 of them per each one of the higher end tires.Low price does not always equal value'The Michelen Cmmander, Avon Conti Tour and the Dunlop E3 all get good reviews on other web forums.

Also worthy of mention is that some of the Metzeler Me 880 tires of Brazillian manufacture,have been reported to have tread separation issues.I had a set on my 750 a few years back and experienced excellent wear and handling from them but I hear through the grapevine the Metzeler name is not as highly thought of now with several VROC members saying they would never trust them again after their experience with them lately.
 

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Old Twistie Sticks Rider
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5,072 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
I will back you up on that,I put 2 ,404 Dunlops on mine last spring and got about 2200 miles out of the set.

I out a set of Dunlop Elite 3 tires on it next and I am still running on both of them.The 404 is just too soft for any but the lightest of bikes and a rathewr conservative rider along with it.
The E3 Dunlops cost about the same as the HD Branded Dunlop which is also a much better wearing tire too.

When it comes to wear and tire life along with price considered,the 404 is just not a good buy.You will go through about 3 of them per each one of the higher end tires.Low price does not always equal value'The Michelen Cmmander, Avon Conti Tour and the Dunlop E3 all get good reviews on other web forums.

Also worthy of mention is that some of the Metzeler Me 880 tires of Brazillian manufacture,have been reported to have tread separation issues.I had a set on my 750 a few years back and experienced excellent wear and handling from them but I hear through the grapevine the Metzeler name is not as highly thought of now with several VROC members saying they would never trust them again after their experience with them lately.
Denny, I can go along on those lines too, I replaced my rear OEM Dunlop 401 @ almost 9k mi. with an ME880 because I remembered good handling & milage with one on an earlier VN750, but I actually got less than 5k out of this ME880, that is why I went to the cheaper Dunlop 404...
I guess it all boils down to, sometimes you do get what you pay for...lol...
The above mentioned Michelin Commander II 150/80/16 was only $130 w/free shipping, I may stay with them and get the 100/90/19 front to match...
BTW-My front Dunlop 110/90/19 is doing pretty darn good...
Have a good one...Old Dog...
 

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I put the HD branded Dunlop's on, Rear last spring and front this spring. The rear has over 6000 miles and still has 3/4 thread left. I put a shinko on the first year I had the bike and only got 2600 miles till it was balder than grandpaw. Had grip but no life.
 

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Crap, I WAS in 5th gear.
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500 Posts
My shinko 230 rear has 7/64" left at 5000 miles. Looks like I'll get 9000-10000 miles out of it.

Tires will last longest if you run them at the max sidewall pressure. Hey Old Dog, have you thought about using a car tire?
 

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Old Twistie Sticks Rider
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5,072 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
I put the HD branded Dunlop's on, Rear last spring and front this spring. The rear has over 6000 miles and still has 3/4 thread left. I put a shinko on the first year I had the bike and only got 2600 miles till it was balder than grandpaw. Had grip but no life.
Yes the HD branded 401 Dunlop is a different animal than the 404, and a bit higher, but much better tire than the 404...

Kelly2001 said:
Hey Old Dog, have you thought about using a car tire?
Ha, ha, no way, not me for sure...lol... I know, I know, they do it, but I just don't have the nerve to use one in these twisties that I love ridin...
Have a good one...Old Dog...
 

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In the '70s, I was a teenager with a Kaw Mach 500, 3 cylinder 2 stoke with a hellashush power band at 6000 rpm. That was hell on wheels in those days as far as power goes. Had a factory tire that was 6 inches wide and flat thread patterned, just like a car tire. I can still remember on the tire sidewall a warning note about cornering speeds printed in the rubber. Great forward grip but would come out from under you in a corner on hot or wet pavement in a heart beat but wet grass,, don't even get me started. Car tires aren't made to lean in a corner and grip, made to stay vertical and sidewall flex while keeping the surf thread flat to the pavement. Heck of a highway tire but not for backroad twistes. Worked with a guy that put a car tire on a Ninja. Pulled out of the office and gassed on it will still leaning, just like he had done for a year. After several stitches and the cast came off his arm he put a bike tire back on.
 

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My shinko 230 rear has 7/64" left at 5000 miles. Looks like I'll get 9000-10000 miles out of it.
I didn't know anything about the Shinko tires when I bought mine other than the dealer put it on a great price. When I was replacing it, I made comment to the guy about the low mileage and he said something to the effect that it was a racing compound rubber in that tire and wouldn't last on high mileage. Said the crouch rocket guys loved them. Don't remeber any numbers on that tire but as I said before, it had grip!
 

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gun slinger
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1,110 Posts
i got one season out of my 404's i switched and haven't looked back
 

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Linkmeister Supreme
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In the '70s, I was a teenager with a Kaw Mach 500, 3 cylinder 2 stoke with a hellashush power band at 6000 rpm. That was hell on wheels in those days as far as power goes. Had a factory tire that was 6 inches wide and flat thread patterned, just like a car tire. I can still remember on the tire sidewall a warning note about cornering speeds printed in the rubber. Great forward grip but would come out from under you in a corner on hot or wet pavement in a heart beat but wet grass,, don't even get me started. Car tires aren't made to lean in a corner and grip, made to stay vertical and sidewall flex while keeping the surf thread flat to the pavement. Heck of a highway tire but not for backroad twistes. Worked with a guy that put a car tire on a Ninja. Pulled out of the office and gassed on it will still leaning, just like he had done for a year. After several stitches and the cast came off his arm he put a bike tire back on.
The tires available now are light years ahead in technolgy to anything available 40 years ago in the `70s.

The guy who put a car tire on the rear of a Ninja did not do his research.
Darksiders have never suggested putting a car tire on a sportbike.

However a CT does seem to work vey well for those who ride cruisers, baggers or geezer glides. :)
Knifemaker even mentioned once how some members on the FJR Forum were instaling them on their Sport Touring bikes.

I have posted a link to Daniel Meyer`s article, "The Dark Side" several times where he recounts his experience running on a car tire (for well over 100k miles at the last update in 2007).
Daniel rides a 2001 Honda Valkyrie 1500 flat 6, which he refers to as a heavy cruiser or a power cruiser.
Here is the link again.
http://lifeisaroad.com/stories/2004/10/27/theDarkSide.html

It is a long read so I will post a few quotes from he link above for those who may be interested in the concept.

As of this writing I have put about 42,000 miles (edit 12/5/07...over 100,000 miles now) on car-tires on my Valkyrie in a multitude of extreme conditions. High-speed highway, high-speed rain, wind, dirt/gravel, twisties, congested city, construction, and emergency stops. I'll take some heat for this, but there is NO downside for the experienced rider. The car tire has been superior in every condition. I've found the car-tire to be so far superior to the MC tire for the rear of the Valkyrie that there is no point in my pretending I'll ever go back to the MC tire.
How does it handle?
I am happy with it. It is very smooth and stable at high speeds, and for me at least, at very low speeds (full deflection turns for instance) it is an improvement over the motorcycle tire. Basically, I've found it to be superior in all conditions.

There are two areas of difference in feel:
It requires active counter-steering to put the bike in a corner.
The Valkyrie has always required a firm hand, and this is not significantly different. The difference is that on the motorcycle tire, once the bike was stable in a corner, driver input on the handlebars is not really needed. The bike will stay in the turn unless power is applied or removed, or the terrain/surface of the road changes. With the car tire, the counter-steering input is required the entire time the bike is in the corner. If it is released, the bike will straighten up on its own. Those of you that push the twisties and know how to drag pegs (really know how to turn) will understand it right away.

The other difference is in what I'll call "bump steer" Varying terrain, such as a ridge on the road, a track in a dirt road, or an angle or crown to the road will give much more feedback than they do on a motorcycle tire. The bike will have the tendency to turn downhill. At highway speeds this is not an issue (not felt), at lower speeds, again, it requires a firm hand on the handlebars and the bike remains well behaved. It is just telling you what it feels on the road. You feel the steering inputs, you do not have to accept them. I prefer the feel, as it puts me much more in touch with what's going on with the road conditions.

The bike turns as aggressively as it ever did. This has not impacted my speeds or angles of lean in turns. I can still drag pegs when I want to, and it has not slowed me down a bit. I am much more confident in wet conditions and with hard braking.
I don`t blame anyone for being sceptical when they hear about running a CT on the rear of a cruiser motorcycle. However enough people have been doing it for thousands miles (well, millions of miles total now I guess) that there is no question about whether it works or not. Why it works makes for some interesting discussion though.
 

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MrSkydriver
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67 Posts
Ride On

To start with, I just got my new Metzler ME880 Marathon tires in. Front 110/90H-19/TL and rear 170/80HB -15. Now I read on the Forum that they are not that great anymore.......:doh: Oh well, I got'em so I'm gonna use'em! My question is, what are your feelings on using Ride On? They claim you don't have to have them balanced when you use it. BTW, it would have saved me a new tire on my Ninja had I used it because I pushed the bike about 10 feet with a nail in it and it pushed through the sidewall....:loser1: Plan on lubing the splines while I have the rear tire off.
Thanks,
Gregg
 
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