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So here I am AGAIN with the carbs off because of a stuck float, this time. Last time was for general cleaning.

What a joke the carb set up on these bikes is!!! In all of my 57 years of riding I have never seen such BS just to get gas and air into a cylinder.

Why doesn't someone make a manifold to run a single carb? It would not be that hard to do. If I still lived in the States, I would be making one right now!!
I would use aluminum tubing the same size of the spicot on the head. Rub a "U" shape from the front cylinder straight out the right side of the engine. This tube would be connected to the head using the stock rubber.
The rear tube would be welded to the from tube and use the stock rubber also.
I would use the little 6mm bolt holding what looks like an oil line at the bottom of the rear cylinder for a bottom support (you don't need much cause the rubbers are fairly strong.

You have plenty of room to cut the main tube short so the carb would sit in without the air cleaner bothering your right leg.

The carb I would use would be the CV that comes stock on Harleys. GREAT CARB and could be picked up plenty cheap from the fools that take them off to put on a S&S or Mikuni. I have had guys give me these carbs before and I have put them on many bikes in the past. You can get parts at any Harley Dealer and the jets are cheap. If the carb works on an 80 incher.....should work just fine on a 40 incher!!!!

The list of air cleaners that are out there for Harleys is very long, so you would have many to choose from.

Just think about how easy it would be to work on your bike and how much better it would look!!

This would be the ultimate earshave!!!!!!!!:lockd::beerchug:
 

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You're not the first to suggest this (maybe 20th?) although I don't recall anyone actually doing it.

I solved the issue myself by trading for a bike with fuel injection and swearing to never buy a carbed bike again.
If you ever had a dead battery in the middle of nowhere you would wish you had that carb'd bike again. Happened to me a few times, roll start and away I went.

I will say though FI bikes are nice, I am better at playing with carbs and jets though.

kenny
 

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If you ever had a dead battery in the middle of nowhere you would wish you had that carb'd bike again. Happened to me a few times, roll start and away I went.

I will say though FI bikes are nice, I am better at playing with carbs and jets though.

kenny
I gotta go with Knife on this one.....
No more carbs for me either.... FI all the way!
 

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I gotta go with Knife on this one.....
No more carbs for me either.... FI all the way!
Until your battery craps out in the middle of nowhere :)

I got my first atv with FI, absolutely hate it, cold start is a problem, warm start is a problem, nail the throttle and it falls on its face or stalls.

I could normally fix all of this with A/F, jets and needle, but now I got this fancy computer thing haha

kenny
 

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Are you sure your name isn't Kenny....but is "Jerry" ?? LOL


Guess you just had a crappy ATV. Every FI bike I've had startred first time, every time be it 90 degrees out or 9.

And in case you missed it, you can buy little control boxes that plug into that "computer" that allow you pick your fuel air mixture for EVERY rpm. Want it a bit richer from 1263 RPMs to 1397 RPMs? Not a problem.

The real cool part of FI now is you can have a choice by a flick of the button whether you want to get the best gas mileage while touring or get the most power while carving up twisties.

It also makes things like traction control and cruise control alot cheaper to install.

Fuk carbs. Keep them if you want, but keep them away from me....;)
 

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Are you sure your name isn't Kenny....but is "Jerry" ?? LOL


Guess you just had a crappy ATV. Every FI bike I've had startred first time, every time be it 90 degrees out or 9.

And in case you missed it, you can buy little control boxes that plug into that "computer" that allow you pick your fuel air mixture for EVERY rpm. Want it a bit richer from 1263 RPMs to 1397 RPMs? Not a problem.

The real cool part of FI now is you can have a choice by a flick of the button whether you want to get the best gas mileage while touring or get the most power while carving up twisties.

It also makes things like traction control and cruise control alot cheaper to install.

Fuk carbs. Keep them if you want, but keep them away from me....;)
Who is Jerry?

I do not mind FI on cars, but for small engines man I love the carbs. Maybe I am weird but all traction control does is make it easier for people who do not know how to drive, give me standard non abs braking and no traction control any day. I did tests on this and I proved I can stop faster in snow then the abs can....smart computer is only as good as the inputs and the ABS on cars is made to let the user stay in control not stop faster. Traction control - is that the thing that cuts the fuel when there is snow on the road and you start spinning, another stupid idea, how are the tires going to self clean with no spinning to eject frozen slush / mud.

Anyway.... I tweaked my bike to have as much power as I could squeeze out of it, I did it with jets and A/F adjustments. needle shims. The guy at the dyno shop asked who did the work, when I said me he was flabbergasted on how dead on I got it.

Knife actually my ATV has an aftermarket control box, been there done that and I am STILL tweaking it, it seems to load up too much when cold, chugs when it does start and if I nail the throttle it stalls, maybe still too lean on fast throttle advance.

You seem to claim to know all about this stuff about FI, you got a few minutes to check my settings?

I would be happy to let you look at them and I can tell you what the ATV is doing.


The atv is not crappy, With the stock ECU I can start it with throttle input, but when cold if I did not let it warm up for like 10 minutes it would not go... it would stall.

So because of those problems with the stock ECU I got an after market one with a different injector, actually the same injector on the M109R...

Anyway if you are interested in helping out that would be great... let me know here is a link to my settings that work well for warmer weather > 50F outside.

http://i376.photobucket.com/albums/oo206/mercury45/MISC/Untitled-2copy.jpg

I dont want this thread to become about my ATV so I will make a new thread

http://www.vn750.com/forum/showthread.php?p=236284#post236284

^^ im with him
Dariv, you too can look at those ATV settings and let me know what you think, I appreciate the help from you FI experts... like I said carb issues, no problem FI - urg... not my cup o tea.

thank you guys, Kenny
 

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Years ago I worked in a parts house and there was an old timer who wandered through who created a base plate that let him bolt a 2bbl Carb off a dodge pickup on his gold wing. He claimed that the thing got ridiculous mileage (100+ per gal) and had better throttle response than it ever did stock. I looked at it in the parking lot and yes, it wasn't pretty, but it sounded real good when he fired it up.

The way that I figure it, if there's no warranty, I can work on carbs all day long. FI is a little tougher unless you understand mapping and such (and have the diagnostic tools to do it) and there are too many sensors that can cause problems.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
You're not the first to suggest this (maybe 20th?) although I don't recall anyone actually doing it.

I solved the issue myself by trading for a bike with fuel injection and swearing to never buy a carbed bike again.
The reason you feel that way is because you never had a problem yet!!
Ask me how much I liked my Ducati with FI when it stalled along way from home when the pump (in the gas tank) fell apart!!

Fuel injection is fairly new to bikes and I think a lot of people like it because of that fact. For what you guys pay for those little fancy tune up gadgets, I can buy a lot of carb parts and install them myself.

In one of the Harley Mags they had a article on how to change back to carb from injection!!
I thought that was really funny and was waiting for just the plan.
 

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Why is everything on this site a debate? Now its carbs vs FI.

FI is newer technology, it will get you better gas mileage and power. My point was that if your battery ever died in the middle of nowhere you would be stuck. Or if one of your sensors went bad you would be screwed or have to pay big money for a new sensor. Carbs dont have all the fancy stuff.

Fuel injection came to market because of emissions stuff, that is the main reason. Now they are doing it not only for emissions but for power and fuel mileage, making more and more complex systems with sensors all over the place.

I have seen FI simply really suck, personal experience. I do not think one is better then the other but I like my carbs because I am am better at carbs. I work on small engines I understand them. It seems the computers on vehicles all have their own quirks based on make and model. Carbs are pretty standard.

when my battery died in the middle of PA if I had FI I would have been dead in the water. I had carb, the group I was with asked if I wanted to call their AAA, I said no, push me across the lot, they all laughed (they all had FI bikes) and said there is no way its going to start. I laughed back and said just push and then we can continue riding, they did, it started and we went on our way.

My buddy got stuck with his FI ATV cause of the injector getting clogged. Tough to clean an injector, but carb parts, no sweat.

Now my ATV, although it could be wonderful, is horrible because of FI settings.... I started a new thread for that, check it out, help would be appreciated.

Anyway I am not debating weather a carb is better then FI... They both have their pros and cons.



In hopes of staying on topic:
I think the OP wants to know about going to a single carb. I know my bike 800cc uses a 36mm single Keihin carb if I recall correctly. I am sure you can find these carbs pretty cheap to try it.

With the 2 carbs do you guys have to sync the carbs? I used to have vacuum gauges for that very purpose. Honda inline 4 CB 500 has 4 carbs, talk about a fun time getting those set right.

that is all for now

kenny
 

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Why is everything on this site a debate?

kenny
No debate, just opinion. There's been dozens of threads here on messed up carbs, and what a pain they are.
Over on the other forums I'm on for FI bikes. Maybe one question on the EFI a month....and that's pushing it.

Generally it's the old farts that like tinkering with their bike that prefer carbs. The ones that like riding a lot more than wrenching seem to favor fuel injection.

In general FI is "better" than carburetors, but it depends on what your criteria is when you say "better" and that seems to be the only dividing issue.

EFI has been used on bikes for over a decade, so I wouldn't call it "new". Every system has its advantages and disadvantages, so making up scenarios where one system fails is pointless as both are prone to problems.

Generally anything mechanical has a better chance of failing do to moving parts.
My car has almost 100,000 miles on it and my wife's over 160,000 and neither has had problems with the EFI.

As far as putting a easier to remove single carb on the Vulcan, I'm all for it.
 

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To take the carb thing a little different direction,did anyone ever think about putting two independent carbs on these bikes.Non siamesed float bowls it should be simple to do and would make pulling carbs a lot easier.Before any one says "what about throttle cables?" That is a simple fix you either make a yoke out of aluminum stock and attach to the carbs or find one of the two stroke engines that used a Y cable ,one went to the carb and the other to the oil injection and attach one to each carb.

Since they both point different directions,they should be easy to fit up and stick a set of pod filters on them and you are ready to go.

Would it be worth the trouble? I don't know if you plan on keeping it a while ,it might be. I know the stock carbs were designed for emissions as well as performance,but they are a PITA.Having the ability to remove and clean one carb that was giving you trouble rather than having to take half the bike apart to get them out I see as a tremendous advantage.

Just throwing an idea out there for you to think about.FWIW

I too have FI bike now and have let the battery go dead,nothing a set of jumper cables did not cure. As a matter of fact I am making up a set of jumper cables to plug from one batter tender plug to another.It doesn't take long to charge one up from another bike equipped with the SAE 2 plug and it is will be small enough to store on the bike easy.I already have an SAE plug attached to a set of charger clips that came with ,my charger.In case i have to jump from a car or a bike that doesn't have a plug on it.
 

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I too have FI bike now and have let the battery go dead,nothing a set of jumper cables did not cure. As a matter of fact I am making up a set of jumper cables to plug from one batter tender plug to another.It doesn't take long to charge one up from another bike equipped with the SAE 2 plug and it is will be small enough to store on the bike easy.I already have an SAE plug attached to a set of charger clips that came with ,my charger.In case i have to jump from a car or a bike that doesn't have a plug on it.
My (actually the round gerbing style) plug is fused so jumping through the plug is not an option, might get away with charging like you said (but even a dead battery may draw more then 10A peak on charge). To hook up and run a starter - no way.

when I said dead battery in my post i mean it basically opened, as soon as you turn the bike off it would not start if you tried, and lights would go dim (low voltage and as soon as you tried to grab some current it would not do anything). Even charging the battery would not have saved me, obviously since the battery was charging the whole time I was running. But roll starting did.


Generally it's the old farts that like tinkering with their bike that prefer carbs. The ones that like riding a lot more than wrenching seem to favor fuel injection.
Old fart at 32, man what will I be called at 75? Had I had fuel injection that day I would have been paying AAA to tow my butt home, instead, I continued riding. I like riding more then wrenching. But appreciate some garage time when weather is bad. I have spent more time farting with my FI ATV on the computer (is that considered wrenching?) and not succeeding then changing stuff on my bike carb. Reliable? Sure got about 40K miles after my carb work / upgrade jets, never took the carb apart in that whole time. My truck has 130K miles, never a problem - that is multi port injection.

I also have a 67 chevy with carb, and it starts no sweat even after sitting half a year, give it some choke pump the pedel and crank it over. What happens to today's cars or trucks if you let them sit have a year, I know mine wont start cause the battery will be dead - the computer draws current even with out being 'on'.

Fuel injection is fine, I just prefer carbs for smaller engines - bikes and such, I just don't have the patience for tweaking FI.


Kenny
 

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My (actually the round gerbing style) plug is fused so jumping through the plug is not an option, might get away with charging like you said (but even a dead battery may draw more then 10A peak on charge). To hook up and run a starter - no way.

when I said dead battery in my post i mean it basically opened, as soon as you turn the bike off it would not start if you tried, and lights would go dim (low voltage and as soon as you tried to grab some current it would not do anything). Even charging the battery would not have saved me, obviously since the battery was charging the whole time I was running. But roll starting did.




Old fart at 32, man what will I be called at 75? Had I had fuel injection that day I would have been paying AAA to tow my butt home, instead, I continued riding. I like riding more then wrenching. But appreciate some garage time when weather is bad. I have spent more time farting with my FI ATV on the computer (is that considered wrenching?) and not succeeding then changing stuff on my bike carb. Reliable? Sure got about 40K miles after my carb work / upgrade jets, never took the carb apart in that whole time. My truck has 130K miles, never a problem - that is multi port injection.

I also have a 67 chevy with carb, and it starts no sweat even after sitting half a year, give it some choke pump the pedel and crank it over. What happens to today's cars or trucks if you let them sit have a year, I know mine wont start cause the battery will be dead - the computer draws current even with out being 'on'.

Fuel injection is great, I just don't have the patience for tweaking it.

Kenny
Why did you omit every thing I said about the carbs and quote only what you wanted to refute?

In case you didn't know it all I have to do tho start my bike is have enough voltage to pump up fuel pressure and it will roll start.I know this from experience. It is a fact if man made it ,it can tear up and strand your butt somewhere.What if you had lost a wheel bearing or what if the chevy truck you have been letting set for 6 mos. at a time has a seal deteriorate and you lose some vital fluids and it strands you.

I know some things are more complicated than others but that doesn't necessarily make them automatically prone to failure.

If I didn't know where you were from I would swear that your name was jerry instead of kenny.

There are times that I keep my mouth shut and let everyone think I am foolish instead of opening it and remove all doubt.Everything is not a debate and I don't have to have the last word on every thing.But I can tell you one thing,you are a hard one to figure out.
 

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Why did you omit every thing I said about the carbs and quote only what you wanted to refute?

In case you didn't know it all I have to do tho start my bike is have enough voltage to pump up fuel pressure and it will roll start.I know this from experience. It is a fact if man made it ,it can tear up and strand your butt somewhere.What if you had lost a wheel bearing or what if the chevy truck you have been letting set for 6 mos. at a time has a seal deteriorate and you lose some vital fluids and it strands you.

I know some things are more complicated than others but that doesn't necessarily make them automatically prone to failure.

If I didn't know where you were from I would swear that your name was jerry instead of kenny.

There are times that I keep my mouth shut and let everyone think I am foolish instead of opening it and remove all doubt.Everything is not a debate and I don't have to have the last word on every thing.But I can tell you one thing,you are a hard one to figure out.
I am relatively new here, I do not know the code of conduct, I see knife maker only quotes portions of my posts so I thought that is the way I should do it to 'save room', I have no problem quoting the whole thing.

Charging up the pump and roll starting makes sense, the biggest problem with a dead battery is getting the pump to charge the lines. I appreciate what the world of FI CAN bring, but for me it has brought nothing but aggravation, same goes for close friends of mine. I know of lots more carb's out there that just keep chugging away. I have a post on my atv, I was hoping the FI experts could comment on it because I am at a loss.

I am from North NJ, don't know what that matters but anyway.

I have said my piece on carbs.

For the Original question... It would be, in my opinion, easier to swap a single carb into the dual carb setup then trying to incorporate FI. If somebody wants to incorporate FI, I would be happy to help them with the circuit to drive the injector and the programming circuit to control the driver. But if they want the swap to take less then a long time, stick with the single carb idea.

Who the heck is Jerry, I keep hearing this name, its Kenny! But if you really want to call me Jerry that's fine. I am very hard to figure out, its not you its me, nobody has me figured out, nobody.
 
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