External oil cooler - Page 3 - Kawasaki Vulcan 750 Forum : Kawasaki VN750 Forums
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post #21 of 103 (permalink) Old 03-02-2014, 11:07 AM
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Not that I am aware of Robert... I have seen a couple here recently due to overheating, but one was a water pump impeller coming loose, and the other was a stuck thermostat.
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post #22 of 103 (permalink) Old 03-02-2014, 11:40 AM
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Awesome job. But I too question the point. I've only heard of (properly running) Vulcans "overheating" when stuck in barely to non moving traffic.

As the oil cooler has no fan, it doesn't seem it be effective unless you're moving...and moving at a significant speed.

Without data this seems a great project, but not one I'd ever believe was nessasary without useful numbers to look at. To be fair, even if it only reduces engine tempature two degrees, you could claim that a benefit....

And us crazy folk that ride when it's really cold out only see it as something that delays the oil warming up....

So I guess I'm just looking at this hoping the benefit of doing this justifies the expense.



And my second question why there are two seperate threads with the same title by the same member in the same forum section? This should have been added to the previous thread....

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Last edited by Knifemaker; 03-02-2014 at 11:50 AM.
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post #23 of 103 (permalink) Old 03-02-2014, 04:31 PM
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It's all very technical, our temp gauge shows a section at the lower end defining I assume warm and suitable to operate the vehicle. At the other end of the scale the gauge has a redline which designates the unsuitable temperature range to run in. The average temperature in operation, set by factory engineers is the midway mark. The extrapolation from this is it's suitable to run in between the two scales. Then we factor in, worn inlet guides which lean the mixture, a heavy load,a mountain range, perhaps a little blow by,and any other factors of which there are many that influence temperature. I personally would rather run left of centre, on a 28 year old bike guaranteed to be far from the new, within tolerance machine supplied near 3 decades ago. I base my Idea's on living in the tropics, where on other machines in perfect order I have seen oil pressure drop to zero, even with oil coolers fitted. This bike mentioned in spec ran pressure 1 to 9 psi stock. I wonder what the standard oil pressure reading is for the VN?

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post #24 of 103 (permalink) Old 03-02-2014, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Chuck A. View Post
All righty then. Lets hit on some good and bad points here. First off, the oil cooler is pretty much a standard on not only bikes but passenger vehicles in this day and time. Don't think so? Go shopping.
I work on everything from 1912 Model T's to present day Dealer warnaty vehicles... The only Time I have ran a crossed engine oil coolers is on 1960-1973 factory muscle cars, and the latest gen muscle and performance cars (assuming that we are talking a liquid cooled engine and not air cooled like the VW Bug and Porsche). Now, transmissions and power steering systems have oil coolers, are you getting confused?
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post #25 of 103 (permalink) Old 03-02-2014, 06:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slimvulcanrider View Post
I work on everything from 1912 Model T's to present day Dealer warnaty vehicles... The only Time I have ran a crossed engine oil coolers is on 1960-1973 factory muscle cars, and the latest gen muscle and performance cars (assuming that we are talking a liquid cooled engine and not air cooled like the VW Bug and Porsche). Now, transmissions and power steering systems have oil coolers, are you getting confused?
He is right slim. of the late model engines have a trans fluid and an oil cooler. My sisters Trailblazer and My work van had factory oil coolers built into the radiator.

Some one else said earlier that stator cooling was not considered an issue and that the TPE stators pretty well cured that,sometimes yes, sometimes no.If there are any of you out there that think otherwise ask Kanuck69. He has experienced Failures with the TPE stator as well as factory.

In the search for a cooler running stator and excess heat is a problem on any electrical device ,ohms law proves it .Heat produces more resistance in coils and that affects voltage, current and the whole smear.

Member of this forum darrelC5 I believe his name was even went far enough to do a major mod to his internal oil lines to spray oil directly on the stator here is a link to his pics http://www.flickr.com/photos/2339973...7605602927618/ I believe darrel thought the lack of oil on the stator was more of a problem than the temperature of the oil. But lower oil temps on submerged electrical components would IMO extend their useful life span.

As far as lowering oil temps too much with an externally mounted coolers,is to me a bit of a stretch especially in a warmer climate. a lot of people run external oil coolers on aircooled engines, if you get a real world drop of 5 to 10 degrees from inlet to outlet you would be flying .That is according to ambient air temps.

I still think it is a good idea and a clean installation. Maybe the wrong guy posted it instead of one of the " boys".




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post #26 of 103 (permalink) Old 03-02-2014, 06:23 PM
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no, I would still ahve my doubts even if one of the "Boys" posted it...

Denny, Real quic question on your TrailBlazer... what year and body package.. we have an '04 LS and it doesn't have an engine oil cooler... I know for sure it doesn't cause I have replaced the radiator in it due to salt corrosion... it does have a Power Steering cooler, and Tranny cooler built into it... We don't have a warranty contract with Ford yet (I am working on them) so I haven't seen 2013 Fords in the shop yet... and it will probably be a while before I see a 2009 or newer Ford Truck in our shop, because Ford here can't sell a truck to save their life... every one is caught up on the new Chevy's and Dodge is offering ridiculously low prices...

I Don't doubt that lowering the oil temp would be good, if it was lowered to around 200 degrees, but like KM and I have been saying... every time a failure due to heat on a normally running bike has been in slow moving traffic or stopped extended periods of idel... so this oil cooler set up wouldn't work in those situations, because no air is moving a crossed to fins to cool them. Any lower than 200 degrees, and the oil viscosity is in the middle of its two points and doesn't lubricate worth a damn.

I also agree with Darcel's theory on the Stator not getting enough oil, and in the other thread made mention to tap into our oil lines that are already present for this purpose.. to inject the cooled oil directly onto the stator, thus warming the oil back up to normal operating temps before it gets pushed back up to the rod and main bearing journals.
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post #27 of 103 (permalink) Old 03-02-2014, 06:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Chuck A. View Post
Denny, I LOVE YOU MAN!

This is a mod that I see will help these engines here in the South with the endless heat we have in the summer months. If it's not for you( being anyone), thanks for reading all the post. By all means, joy your bike either way. Still yet, Can a moderator make this a sticky just encase someone else would benefit from this mod.
its already sticky, and If you feel I am knocking your idea, I am not, I just am skeptical, as always... hence I suggested data to back up your mod.
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post #28 of 103 (permalink) Old 03-02-2014, 06:33 PM Thread Starter
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You are right. Just waiting on summer time to see my if it works well.

I'll just add this picture here. Looks decent in day light. Oh, I did wash the bike today. Should have before the other pictures.
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post #29 of 103 (permalink) Old 03-02-2014, 06:41 PM
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I always thought the oil in a motor was to lubricate the internal moving parts, not cool the engine.

Again I should make clear I don't think putting an oil cooler on the Vulcan is a bad idea. I just question how usefull it really is compared to the expense. No data other than seat of the pants speculation. Please don't tell me about how your car or truck has one as rationale. They don't have exposed motors and don't weigh the same.....so not a good example.

My Bonneville has an oil cooler, and I'm sure the folks that built the thing thought it be a good idea, but I'm not going to compare a liquid cooled bike to an aircooled bike either.

I do want to ask if you added more oil to the bike to make up the volume the cooler contains?

And does anyone know what oil tempature the bike has on a hot day (without a cooler) and what tempature the oil would need to reach to cause a problem?

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post #30 of 103 (permalink) Old 03-02-2014, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knifemaker View Post
I always thought the oil in a motor was to lubricate the internal moving parts, not cool the engine.

Again I should make clear I don't think putting an oil cooler on the Vulcan is a bad idea. I just question how usefull it really is compared to the expense. No data other than seat of the pants speculation. Please don't tell me about how your car or truck has one as rationale. They don't have exposed motors and don't weigh the same.....so not a good example.

My Bonneville has an oil cooler, and I'm sure the folks that built the thing thought it be a good idea, but I'm not going to compare a liquid cooled bike to an aircooled bike either.

I do want to ask if you added more oil to the bike to make up the volume the cooler contains?

And does anyone know what oil tempature the bike has on a hot day (without a cooler) and what tempature the oil would need to reach to cause a problem?
It is for lubrication, nobody would argue that, but as temp increase viscosity decreases making it run thinner and faster. But that's why different geographical climates call for different weights in oil right?

Ps , maybe you can program your computer to just replace all your periods with winkfaces. Might make replying quicker and easier


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