Carb/fuel Problem... - Kawasaki Vulcan 750 Forum : Kawasaki VN750 Forums
Carbs and Fuel System
From the gas tank to the carbs
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-06-2008, 05:37 PM Thread Starter
 
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Carb/fuel Problem...

i have a 2005 750 was running fine then started running rough and not idling. So i got to looking into the problem i found that the tank had lots of rust in it that i assumed to be the problem. So I took the tank off and sent it to the radiator shop to clean out the rust. they did a good job of it. But I figured I needed to take the carb off and make sure that it was cleaned out as well. So after i got it out i took it apart and cleaned rust out, floats had rust all around them. I took pictures of everything as i took it apart to make sure i got it put back together. Well I have it all put back together and got it to start. But it will idle for about 2-3 minutes then die. after it is started if I try to give it ANY throttle it dies immediately. If I turn the idle screw in at all it dies. Any ideas as to what I should look into to get it running again.
I really don't want to take it to the local shop. Long story short, they sold it to me and it started running rough so i took it back they tore it all down and put it back together, $1,097.00, saying they had to redo the push rods and other things. then when it got to running rough again this time around and I went back to them with it, that is when they said your tank has rust in it and is more than likely causing the same thing again. I found out that the mechanic who tore it all down didnt have a clue what was wrong until they put it back together but didnt bother to send the tank in to get it cleaned.
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-06-2008, 05:43 PM
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Sounds like you have a definite complaint with the shop - a 2005 that's got a tank that badly rusted? And then you needed a major rebuild of stuff on top of that? How long ago did you buy the bike from them? And where are they located? I'd be calling the Better Business Bureau about now.
As for your fuel flow situation, check a few things: first, make sure the petcock doesn't have any rust or crud in it, either. I'd pull that completely apart and clean it top to bottom; ditto on the fuel lines - if you can, just replace them. Finally, did you synchronize the carbs when you reinstalled them? Not saying that that's the problem, but it will rule it out if they've been sync'd.

Oh, and welcome to the Forum! Glad you found us!

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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-06-2008, 05:55 PM Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for fast response.
bought the bike used in Feb, 2007. Had problems with it running off and on. Took to the shop and they would make minor adjustments (carb i assume). then it would seem to run like a jewel. Finally, it was real bad and I had to haul it into the shop, May, 2008. Thats when they did the partial overhaul. Then it was running like a jewel again. After about 4 months it started running rough again. So I called the shop and talked with shop manager who said to bring it back in and he would take a look. So after I took it in and then they called me back and said that it had rust in the tank but let it slip that they noticed the rust from the last time I had it in the shop. After a lot of back and forth talk, he said that they should have notified me about the rust and/or sent it to the radiator shop themselves. So I could have them fix the problem but I would have to pay for it or I could fix it myself. So I figured I had better get to learning about my bike now.
Location: Lubbock, TX
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-06-2008, 05:57 PM Thread Starter
 
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Sync the carbs?

I missed that in the post. Angry about the whole thing.
What do you mean by sync the carbs. All I did was put everything back the way it came apart.
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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-06-2008, 08:22 PM
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Dag - but now the cost of your bike is $1000 + more than you initially paid for it. Anyone in Lubbock who could help out a fellow Vulcaneer?

The carburetors have to be synchronized in order to work properly - this entails getting the throttle plates to let the same amount of air/fuel mix into each carburetor. I'll see if I can post some pics for you, but basically, there's a flate plate in each carb that swivels on a pivot when you twist the throttle. The idle adjust screw will adjust the plate in your front carb; the "carb sync screw" (located underneath the carb unit) adjusts the plate in the rear carb. What you want to do before you reinstall the carbs is to get the plates pretty close to each other -someone suggested I use a thin piece of paper; insert it under each plate and try to get the same amount of "tug" on the paper from each when you go to remove it. Then you put the carbs back on, and use a manometer to balance them. The manometer is just a long tube of fluid - about 30", two open ends. You hook one end up to the vacuum line on the front carb, one to the vac line on the rear carb. The goal is to get the fluid in each "half" of the tube to sit even with each other (the vacuum "pulls" on the fluid - if the carbs are sync'd, both the front and rear "pull" will be equal, thereby keeping the fluid at an even keel. Here's a link to how to build a cheap tool - it's what's sitting in my garage. http://www.powerchutes.com/manometer.asp

I'll see if I can post a few pictures for you. If you have the Clymer's manual, that'll help explain the whole process. If you don't, I'm sure someone here has a link to an online version (I know you can download the service manual from TOC Manufacturing's website (tocmanufacturing.com, I tihnk).

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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-06-2008, 08:46 PM
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https://www.vn750.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=548

Here's a link to the gallery pics on parts to your carbs, and here are four pics that show the throttle plates and where the adjustment screws are. Holler if you need any more info - there's tons of folks here who can help you out!
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Name:	Plates swivel as throttle linkage is moved.JPG
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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-06-2008, 09:01 PM
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Great explaination and pics Cindy.Thanks for the contributions.

Gordon

1991 VN 750 -"Cosmic Lady" or "Bad Girl"?
Purchased May 16, 2008
Approx.19,300km (12,000 miles)

H-D windshield
Relocated R/R
MF-AGM battery
Fiamm Freeway Blaster horns
F&S luggage rack and engine guard
Kury Offset Hiway pegs
July 13, 2016, Riding on the DARKSIDE now, Classic Radial 165/80-15


TOP TEN THINGS A NEW RIDER/OWNER SHOULD DO. Click on link.
https://www.vn750.com/forum/11-vn750-general-discussion/9127-top-ten-items-you-would-suggest-new-owner-do-his-new-ride.html

Last edited by OlHossCanada; 11-06-2008 at 09:06 PM.
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-07-2008, 03:20 AM
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That shop hosed you buddy. This bike doesn't have push rods, it uses chains....

Also, since the tank was so bad, then the gas tank valve was very dirty too. Did that get cleaned out as well?
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-07-2008, 08:52 PM
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I went back and reread this whole thread, and I agree with Cindy back in post #2. You should contact the BBB or Chamber of Commerce or whatever similar local business association you have, and register a complaint against the dealership shop. Gather up all the paper work you have, including all estimates, work orders and invoices for work done. Especially note any written notes or remarks the mechanic or service manager made on the work order that should be returned to you when you paid the bill. If there is any mention of "push rods" on your bike, highlight it. 750Doug is right, there are no pushrods, only chains and overhead cams. Also make note of any mention of rust in the tank, written or verbal as you said above. Did you have to pay for all the other visits to the shop for adjustments, or just the $1097 mentioned for the partial overhaul?

I think you may have a good arguement to get reimbursed for at least half of the $1097 you paid for the "overhaul", and all charges for any subsequent adjustments. You say the service manager let it slip that they knew about the rust in the tank, at the time of the overhaul and did not fix it or tell you, so you could fix it. Therefore any visits to the shop after that time were a result of their negligence or incompetance. Before doing any more work on the bike, talk to the BBB as Cindy mentioned, and see what they can do for you. The dealer may offer to take in your bike and set the tuning on the carb and make it ready to ride, since you have already cleaned the tank and carb. Maybe they would also clean or rebuild the petcock and clean or replace the fuel lines, as well as anything else related to the work that should have been done the first time. You will have to decide whether you trust them touching your bike again, after enduring their seeming incompetance. Another option may be a credit note you can use to purchase merchandise, if they won`t refund cash. Just some ideas for you to consider. The more flexible you are, the more likely you are to get some satisfactory results.

You say that the tank has now been cleaned of rust. Was it treated in any way to prevent a reoccurance of the rusting? There is an article in the Verses called "rusty tank", which describes a simple method of treating a rusty tank at home, that coats the inside of the tank to prevent future rusting. I recommend reading it, although I have not tried the procedure myself.

Regarding syncing the carbs, I used the search feature last night and entered the words manometer carb syncing, or something close to that, and came up with one or two informative threads. The main jist of what I read , seems to indicate that most of us do not need to worry about checking it if our bikes are running well and smooth. If your bike is running rough or with a lot of vibration, or if you have done work on them, that maybe an indication that syncing is needed.

If you have the carbs off already, Cindy has an explanation up in post #5 about how to set the throttle plates to start opening at the same time for both front and rear carbs. In the case of a two cylinder bike this visual/manual procedure is probably all that is needed. This is what the syncing procedure is trying to achieve. According to the thread I searched out, an engine with 3, 4 or more cylinders will need more frequent syncronizing simply because of the greater complexity of balancing 4 carbs instead of only 2.

I`m not sure what your idle problem is, but try this. Count the number of revolutions it takes to turn the black idle adjust knob all the way in clockwise. slimvulcanrider said a few days ago, that turning it out about 2 1/4 turn ccw from here should be close to where it needs to be. If you were significantly more or less than that, maybe it will start and run now. Sorry for being so long winded, but that dealer ship screwing you over like that, p`d me right off. I hope something I`ve suggested here helps. Good luck.

Gordon

1991 VN 750 -"Cosmic Lady" or "Bad Girl"?
Purchased May 16, 2008
Approx.19,300km (12,000 miles)

H-D windshield
Relocated R/R
MF-AGM battery
Fiamm Freeway Blaster horns
F&S luggage rack and engine guard
Kury Offset Hiway pegs
July 13, 2016, Riding on the DARKSIDE now, Classic Radial 165/80-15


TOP TEN THINGS A NEW RIDER/OWNER SHOULD DO. Click on link.
https://www.vn750.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9127
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-07-2008, 11:09 PM
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I am close to Lubbock, but I am no help with these carb. I need to rejett, but every time I look at the work involved I chicken out. lol.

02 honda sabre 1100
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