A starter issue ?? - Kawasaki Vulcan 750 Forum : Kawasaki VN750 Forums
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Where does this wire go?
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post #1 of 37 (permalink) Old 03-21-2007, 04:58 PM Thread Starter
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Cool A starter issue ??

I have a BIG starting issue with my bike (a94's VN750)
In fact she has this issue for a long time now, the first owner (a work collegue) bought it new, and after a while he has this starting issue.
He went to the dealer and (with the warranty ok) solved the problem.

So the bike was quite new , may be few months.

After a while more, the same issue appear another time, he said s...t !! will go like that... and nothing was done (except pushed her to start ) until the shaft was broken. (and also the starter burned because he said that she will start or die, she died!
(he has plugged a car batt on the starter and wait to start until it burned)

Few years standing on his garage...

Another work collegue bought it, and repaired the shaft, cleaned the carbs a new std batt, an used starter and ride, and still push her to start.

Last year I bought it, and started to find the starting issue !

change the wire from the starter relay to the starter (thicker one), clean and put some contact grease on connections , result, a little bit better, she starts some time, but only when she's cold, on refueling I have to push....
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post #2 of 37 (permalink) Old 03-21-2007, 05:06 PM Thread Starter
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I've changed the wire from the batt to the starter relay, the wire from the batt to the ground, connections cleaned.
And today to follow the advices from the verses try with a car batt in // to start.
In fact it seems that the starter isn't running so fast compare to http://pages.tstar.net/~fergy/images...50_startup.wav

some ideas ?
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post #3 of 37 (permalink) Old 03-21-2007, 05:08 PM
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How old is the battery? I am willing to bet that the battery is your problem. Dump the acid battery and get yourself a maintenance free battery.
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post #4 of 37 (permalink) Old 03-21-2007, 10:33 PM
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I second Rubline. The Maintenance Free battery seems to cure hard starting issues.

Jim W
93 VN 750 "Ursula"
Moved R/R 08Sep06
R/R rewire 17Feb07
New R/R, Installed 14Jun08
New Stator installed 10 Jun08
Maintenance Free Battery 12Jan08
21480 Miles
VROC #8542
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post #5 of 37 (permalink) Old 03-22-2007, 01:22 PM Thread Starter
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Yes I've noticed that, but how could we explain that when I put a big car battery in paralel, she doesn't start quickly, it seems that the starter has not enough speed.
When I press the start button and I also walk on the side with the fisrt gear engaged ( and playing with the clutch) she starts fine ! on 2 meters except after refueling
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post #6 of 37 (permalink) Old 03-22-2007, 01:37 PM
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So even when using a car battery, the starter sounds like it's turning too slowly? Still sounds like there's a short between the battery and the starter, i.e., that there's a voltage drop somewhere between the two. (Pour m'assurer que je vous comprends: Meme quand on utilise la batterie de l'auto, le <starter> functionne trop lentement? Il me paraitre qu'il y a peut-etre un <short> (comment le dit-on? quand l'electricite se perde entre tous les deux) entre la batterie and le <starter>. En effet, on doit chercher si le voltage se tombe au le terminal positive, et aussi l'on de terre.)

C
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post #7 of 37 (permalink) Old 03-22-2007, 02:05 PM Thread Starter
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Red face Thanks for trying french

Hi, in fact I've changed the wires from the batt to the starter, I can't see where it could get a short ...

I've plugged the car batt on + batt and on - batt and also on + batt and the ground near the starter

same speed

May be a short inside the starter, how could I check that

or in the starter relay ?
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post #8 of 37 (permalink) Old 03-22-2007, 08:40 PM
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Here's what I've been reading, and maybe someone else can comment on whether this is a reasonable approach or not: the book is Motorcycle Electrical Systems: Troubleshooting and Repair (Tracy Martin, author). Page 80 there is a description that sounds like your bike and which made me think you want to do a voltage drop test. But here's the text, someone else can comment:

SLOW TURNING STARTER, LOW AMPERAGE
...If an ammeter reading is low... and the starter is turning slowly or not at all, the starter circuit has high resistance caused by either a poor battery cable connection or a bad solenoid. HIgh resistance is, by far, the most common reason for low starter circuit amperage. ...a voltage drop test is the ideal test to locate the source of unwanted high resistance in teh starter circuit.

The positive side of the starter circuit should be tested first, as it is the most likely place to find a problem. Connect the red lead of a voltmeter to the positive battery terminal (NOT the battery cable). Connect the black meter lead to the starter terminal where the battery cable is attached. Crank the engine over, while watching the voltmeter. If the voltage drop is less than 0.5 volts (less than 0.2 for small engines [I think we're in th e0.5 category], the positive side of the starter circuit doesn't have high resistance. Perform the same test on the ground side of the starter circuit. Connect the red voltmeter lead to the starter case, the black lead to the negative terminal on the battery, and then crank the engine. The voltage drop should not exceed 0.4 volts...If either the positive or negative side of the starter circuit exceeds the maximum voltage drop...the point of high resistance can be located by peforming a voltage drop test across individual connections. This can be accomplished by disconnecting the black voltmeter lead and moving it back aclong the circuit toward the red meter lead. There should be no more than 0.2 volts lost across any connection. Fortunately, cleaning a bad connection is oftentimes all that is required to get the start to spin faster. Performing a voltage drop test on the starter and solenoid is generally easier than removing the starter and replacing it, only to find that a bad or loose connection was the cause of the slow turning starter."

There are nice diagrams in this book for performing a voltage drop test, but maybe you can search the internet and see if you can locate images elsewhere. The idea, however, is that the load device (the solenoid, the starter...) should be using the 12 volts coming to it from the battery. The voltage drop test measures the difference between the voltage detected at the positive lead (12 v) and the voltage detected at the negative lead (hopefully close to zero volts). 12v - 0v = 12v on the meter, indicating that there was no voltage lost to a short in the circuit. If the meter reads 10 volts, then 12 volts are being measured at the red lead, 2 are being measured at the black lead, meaning there was a loss of 2 volts to the circuit somewhere along the line. Moving the leads helps you detect where that loss occurs.

Okay, someone else can pick it up from here, 'cause this is my exercise for this weekend...but hopefully that at least can get you started.

C
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post #9 of 37 (permalink) Old 03-22-2007, 10:03 PM
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I too like many others had a hard time starting with a hot engine,I put on a sealed battery and they went away.If after this you still have a problem try modiyfing your pickup coil gaps(I hade a Kawasaki Mechanic tell me this before I found this place{strange he didnt know about the Battery thing though}).If after this you still have a problem look for excessive resistance in the circuit. THE GAP THING------ https://www.vn750.com/forum/showthrea...ghlight=pickup

Last edited by moontroll; 03-22-2007 at 10:08 PM.
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post #10 of 37 (permalink) Old 03-22-2007, 10:14 PM
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I think the Gap thing should be in the verses,it took me three minutes to find it.
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