In Wiring Hell!!! Please help - Kawasaki Vulcan 750 Forum : Kawasaki VN750 Forums
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Where does this wire go?
Includes Electrical mods, Lights, Stator,
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post #1 of 37 (permalink) Old 07-24-2011, 12:54 PM Thread Starter
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Unhappy In Wiring Hell!!! Please help

Ok, so I tried searching the boards for an answer and only kept digging myself a deeper hole. I am going to try and lay out everything I have done concisely so that the whole picture is clear.

1. Changed headlight to HID Xenon from Lumenez - everything worked fine
2. Changed brakelight to LED board from Moto Lume - everything worked fine

3. Installed LED Flasher Relay from Show Chrome Accessories - everything worked fine.
4. Changed front TS to LEDs from Custom Dynamics - everything worked fine
5. Changed rear TS to LED with running/brake lights from Custom Dynamics - blew a fuse after initial install, re-did all the wiring - everything worked fine.

6. Battery Died - did some testing, ruled out stator decided to change R/R to Shindeghan MOSFET--
charging DCV before change was 12.6-13.0 from idle - 6K RPM......After change was 12.7-13.5 same RPM range. This seemed strange to me so I had the battery tested and it was fine. So I figured perhaps I have a ground short somewhere. When I went to start looking for it, I noticed my headlight wasn't running. I looked up posts about that issue after the MOSFET install and noticed this

Headlight Not working after Install Thread...

I mostly paid attention to the posts by VulcanJoe and Denny as they seemed the most appropriate for me.

Post #7 seemed to be the answer, and if you read on to further posts it almost seems as though somehow my low charging voltage may have been related to this.

Post 7 reads
"i had the same problem when i installed mine so i wired it up like the factory with the stator lead to the jb then the r/r would not charge what i did was take the brown sense wire from the old r/r connector and solder it to the yellow wire from the small plug on the j/b. the headlight is on all the time now there is no longer a delay to turn on the headlight. hope this helps "

I misread this and tapped the Brown Sense wire into the yellow wire from the stator leading into the JB. Obviously, my headlight turned on (only after pushing start button), no other lights did, and in 30 seconds the main 30 amp fuse blew. I disconnected the wires I just put together to realize I just sent VAC voltage on the brown wire and it melted and shorted to the old ground wire in the no longer used R/R connector. So, I disconnected and fixed my cut. Now I am stumped, I do not see any other yellow wires coming from the JB other than the one from the stator. My headlight does not work at all, and I do not know where to attach the brown wire.

I think that this brown wire just needs to get 12V power to turn on the headlight, but I am not sure.

any help please

P.S. - I removed the White and Ground wires from the old R/R connector at the point where they join other wires because I wanted to clear up some space and get rid of the uneccessary wires.

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post #2 of 37 (permalink) Old 07-24-2011, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
"i had the same problem when i installed mine so i wired it up like the factory with the stator lead to the jb then the r/r would not charge what i did was take the brown sense wire from the old r/r connector and solder it to the yellow wire from the small plug on the j/b. the headlight is on all the time now there is no longer a delay to turn on the headlight. hope this helps "
Very, VERY bad advice. As soon as the R/R turns on the FET of that phase, the FET shorts the battery. I'm afraid you have ruined your new R/R.

With the FH012AA, you leave the brown wire disconnected, just make sure it does not get shorted anywhere.
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post #3 of 37 (permalink) Old 07-24-2011, 04:21 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pappa View Post
Very, VERY bad advice. As soon as the R/R turns on the FET of that phase, the FET shorts the battery. I'm afraid you have ruined your new R/R.

With the FH012AA, you leave the brown wire disconnected, just make sure it does not get shorted anywhere.
I'm not sure I fully understand your post, but I'm pretty certain you are either misunderstanding my problem, or mistaken because...
after I took everything apart and examined the wiring diagrams and wiring harness, I soldered the stator wires directly to the R/R (removing the bullet connectors), still have the 1 stator wire split and going to the JB as it was stock, and have the red wire out of the R/R going to the battery and the black going to ground. The brown wire is disconnected as it was after I initially installed the new R/R

Long story short, everything is exactly as it was after R/R installation as per instructions. Battery charges between 12.6-13.5V depending on RPM so R/R is still working, but headlight still does not work at all. Since this brown wire is tied into the headlight circuit I assume the problem lies with this wire.

All other circuits work properly, and all fuses are good.

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post #4 of 37 (permalink) Old 07-24-2011, 06:52 PM
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Leave the brown wire alone. Insulate it and forget about it....
I believe most people just move the blue wire in the 8 pin connector of the JB to the empty pin next to it. (IIRC, pin 8 to 7). This solves the headlight problem.
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post #5 of 37 (permalink) Old 07-24-2011, 08:00 PM
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You may already know some of this, but let me try to explain some things. The only wires that need to go to the new R/R is the stator wires and the two new wires that come with the kit for the battery. When I replaced my stator I used the original yellow wires on the bike because of the one that went to the JB. The WHT/R wire you can cut at the R/R connector and tape it off or use a heat shrink cap if you can find them, this wire is the positive lead from the R/R which you replace with a new one from the Mosfet to the battery. Your original battery wire stays in place and the Mosfet positive wire gets is added to the positive lead of the battery. The WHT/R wire being cut at the R/R doesnt matter because it is spliced elseware in the harness and is still connected to the battery. Pretty much the same thing for the BLK ground wire. The BRN wire like you mentioned is the sensing wire. IT IS NO LONGER NEEDED FOR THE MOSFET. What this wire did was take output of the R/R via the WHT/R wire through the ignition switch and feed it back to the R/R. I guess the original R/R needed to know what it was putting out. So this wire gets cut and stowed also. The yellow stator wire that goes to the JB operates the headlight relay, this is how the headlight works only when the bike is running. Basicly when you tied the yellow and the BRN wire together you took the output of the R/R 12-14 VDC and connected it to the output of the stator 50-70 VAC. OUCH !!!!! So there is a good chance you fried something. I would check continuity of the stator wires, maybe even check the output while the bike is running just to be sure your stator is good. You can find several post on how to check the stator. Hook up the Mosfet correctly. Then check the output of the mosfet, I get almost 14 VDC at idle, If the input to the mosfet is good (stator voltage) and the output is bad I would say you damaged the Mosfet. THAT IS IF YOU DIDNT FRY ANYTHING ELSE. Personally I left the headlight circuit alone, so it would operate as designed, not moving the blue wire, There will not be a headlight issue when the mosfet is installed correctly. When my headlight went out it was the only indication I had that there was a problem (bad stator). You mentioned removing the WHT/R and the BLK wires completly from the bike to where they spliced, I guess it would be ok as long as you didnt disturb the actual splice or respliced the wires after removing the unneeded ones. Hope this helps you understand whats going on. Here is a link of how I installed my mosfet.

https://www.vn750.com/forum/showthrea...ghlight=mosfet

Last edited by ifixf18s; 07-24-2011 at 08:07 PM.
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post #6 of 37 (permalink) Old 07-24-2011, 09:17 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ifixf18s View Post
You may already know some of this, but let me try to explain some things. The only wires that need to go to the new R/R is the stator wires and the two new wires that come with the kit for the battery. When I replaced my stator I used the original yellow wires on the bike because of the one that went to the JB. The WHT/R wire you can cut at the R/R connector and tape it off or use a heat shrink cap if you can find them, this wire is the positive lead from the R/R which you replace with a new one from the Mosfet to the battery. Your original battery wire stays in place and the Mosfet positive wire gets is added to the positive lead of the battery. The WHT/R wire being cut at the R/R doesnt matter because it is spliced elseware in the harness and is still connected to the battery. Pretty much the same thing for the BLK ground wire. The BRN wire like you mentioned is the sensing wire. IT IS NO LONGER NEEDED FOR THE MOSFET. What this wire did was take output of the R/R via the WHT/R wire through the ignition switch and feed it back to the R/R. I guess the original R/R needed to know what it was putting out. So this wire gets cut and stowed also. The yellow stator wire that goes to the JB operates the headlight relay, this is how the headlight works only when the bike is running. Basicly when you tied the yellow and the BRN wire together you took the output of the R/R 12-14 VDC and connected it to the output of the stator 50-70 VAC. OUCH !!!!! So there is a good chance you fried something. I would check continuity of the stator wires, maybe even check the output while the bike is running just to be sure your stator is good. You can find several post on how to check the stator. Hook up the Mosfet correctly. Then check the output of the mosfet, I get almost 14 VDC at idle, If the input to the mosfet is good (stator voltage) and the output is bad I would say you damaged the Mosfet. THAT IS IF YOU DIDNT FRY ANYTHING ELSE. Personally I left the headlight circuit alone, so it would operate as designed, not moving the blue wire, There will not be a headlight issue when the mosfet is installed correctly. When my headlight went out it was the only indication I had that there was a problem (bad stator). You mentioned removing the WHT/R and the BLK wires completly from the bike to where they spliced, I guess it would be ok as long as you didnt disturb the actual splice or respliced the wires after removing the unneeded ones. Hope this helps you understand whats going on. Here is a link of how I installed my mosfet.

https://www.vn750.com/forum/showthrea...ghlight=mosfet

Ok, That's the thing. I followed your instructions to the T. The only reason I tired connecting the brown wire to the yellow wire was because my headlight wasn't working.

Also my voltage across the battery was low before I attached the brown wire also.

After putting everything back together all voltages/resistance measurments at all locations are exactly the same as they were before I connected things.

The reason I do not think I fried anything, is I don;t think I actually turned the engine over, I just hit the starter button real quick to make sure the headlight turned on. I was not running the engine. So I am not entirely sure why the wire got so hot and melted through the casing and grounded itself out..

Either way, my headlight does work when it gets power. This I am sure of, but with everything installed exactly the way you did it, the headlight does not work.

I hope this explains a little bit better why I am so confused...

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post #7 of 37 (permalink) Old 07-24-2011, 09:20 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dariv View Post
Leave the brown wire alone. Insulate it and forget about it....
I believe most people just move the blue wire in the 8 pin connector of the JB to the empty pin next to it. (IIRC, pin 8 to 7). This solves the headlight problem.

Thanks, that is what I needed to know.

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post #8 of 37 (permalink) Old 07-24-2011, 09:34 PM
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Just breaking the large block of information in the previous post into bite sized pieces that I can digest. Thanks for the clear explanation of the mosfet mod on the Vulcan ifixf18s.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ifixf18s View Post
You may already know some of this, but let me try to explain some things.

The only wires that need to go to the new R/R is the stator wires and the two new wires that come with the kit for the battery.

When I replaced my stator I used the original yellow wires on the bike because of the one that went to the JB.

The WHT/R wire you can cut at the R/R connector and tape it off or use a heat shrink cap if you can find them, this wire is the positive lead from the R/R which you replace with a new one from the Mosfet to the battery.

Your original battery wire stays in place and the Mosfet positive wire gets is added to the positive lead of the battery. The WHT/R wire being cut at the R/R doesnt matter because it is spliced elseware in the harness and is still connected to the battery.

Pretty much the same thing for the BLK ground wire.

The BRN wire like you mentioned is the sensing wire. IT IS NO LONGER NEEDED FOR THE MOSFET. What this wire did was take output of the R/R via the WHT/R wire through the ignition switch and feed it back to the R/R. I guess the original R/R needed to know what it was putting out. So this wire gets cut and stowed also.

The yellow stator wire that goes to the JB operates the headlight relay, this is how the headlight works only when the bike is running. Basicly when you tied the yellow and the BRN wire together you took the output of the R/R 12-14 VDC and connected it to the output of the stator 50-70 VAC. OUCH !!!!! So there is a good chance you fried something.

I would check continuity of the stator wires, maybe even check the output while the bike is running just to be sure your stator is good. You can find several post on how to check the stator.

Hook up the Mosfet correctly. Then check the output of the mosfet, I get almost 14 VDC at idle, If the input to the mosfet is good (stator voltage) and the output is bad I would say you damaged the Mosfet. THAT IS IF YOU DIDNT FRY ANYTHING ELSE.

Personally I left the headlight circuit alone, so it would operate as designed, not moving the blue wire, There will not be a headlight issue when the mosfet is installed correctly. When my headlight went out it was the only indication I had that there was a problem (bad stator).

You mentioned removing the WHT/R and the BLK wires completly from the bike to where they spliced, I guess it would be ok as long as you didnt disturb the actual splice or respliced the wires after removing the unneeded ones. Hope this helps you understand whats going on. Here is a link of how I installed my mosfet.

https://www.vn750.com/forum/showthrea...ghlight=mosfet

Gordon

1991 VN 750 -"Cosmic Lady" or "Bad Girl"?
Purchased May 16, 2008
Approx.19,300km (12,000 miles)

H-D windshield
Relocated R/R
MF-AGM battery
Fiamm Freeway Blaster horns
F&S luggage rack and engine guard
Kury Offset Hiway pegs
July 13, 2016, Riding on the DARKSIDE now, Classic Radial 165/80-15


TOP TEN THINGS A NEW RIDER/OWNER SHOULD DO. Click on link.
https://www.vn750.com/forum/11-vn750-general-discussion/9127-top-ten-items-you-would-suggest-new-owner-do-his-new-ride.html
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post #9 of 37 (permalink) Old 07-25-2011, 12:58 AM
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Can we do a sticky of this? Or an entry in the verses?
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post #10 of 37 (permalink) Old 07-25-2011, 04:21 AM
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Perhaps an image will help you understand what I am saying:



You connected the brown wire from the ignition switch to the yellow wire from the JB. The engine did not have to start running, just turn fast enough for the stator to output enough voltage for the R/R to trigger the FET (probably the instant you released the start button).

This created a path for the current to flow from the positive battery terminal to the negative battery terminal (the dashed red path in the image).

Since FETs keep on conducting until the current drops to zero, the current kept flowing until the main fuse blew. There is a good chance that the FET failed and shorted out. You can test with a resistance meter if any of the AC inputs of the R/R is shorted to the R/R ground wire. If you are lucky, there was enough resistance in the wires to limit the current so that only the fuse blew and no other damage was done.
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