Extended Warranty--??? - Kawasaki Vulcan 750 Forum : Kawasaki VN750 Forums
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-29-2011, 09:37 AM Thread Starter
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Extended Warranty--???

First, I am in no way a fan of extended warranties...
But I have got 2-oil analysis that may make me lay down the big bucks, what do y'all think...???
Here are the briefs from Blackstone Labs. ...

1st Sample, 3-21-2011---11,230 mi. on bike, 3,100 mi. on oil....
JOE: Universal averages show what we expect to see out of a 1200cc Harley engine after about 2,200
miles on the oil. You ran your oil a little longer, so your wear should be a little higher. But copper, lead, and
tin should not be this high and they show extra metal coming from a bronze part of the bearings. The TBN
read 6.5, which is a strong reading. It shows this oil had plenty of active additive left in it, so you could go
longer on the oil. But we don't suggest doing that since wear is high. No water or fuel was in the oil. Oil
filtration is good (see insolubles). Use 2K mi next. (Lead=8, Avg.=3)(Tin=13, Avg.=1)(Copper=54, Avg.=17)

2nd Sample, 7-21-2011---14,000 mi. on bike, 2,670 mi. on oil...
JOE: Copper, lead, and tin are still on the high side in this sample from your Sportster. They do look a little
better compared to last time, which is good, but we can't give the engine a clean bill of health just yet. These
three metals together can show bearing wear, though copper and tin can also show wear at any bronze
part. The other metals stayed nice and low. The viscosity was fine and no fuel was found. Air
and oil filtration were also normal. The TBN was 6.7 showing lots of active additive. Try going back up to
3,000 miles next time and check back. (Lead=6, Avg.=3)(Tin=9, Avg.=1)(Copper=44, Avg.=17)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It just don't sound too good to me and I am thinking about doin the 2 yr. extra warranty at about $880 which is high, but considering a trashed engine job at a Harley shop it might be the best route to go... My 2 yr. warranty runs out Aug. 9th in less than 2 weeks, I must deside before it runs out...
I know y'all are not Harley folks, but my being on this forum so long and owning the VN750s I value your opinions very much...
What do y'all folks think about it...???
Thanks and have a good one...Old Dog...

Southern Central Tennessee.......
Now on the Dark Side......
Girl's Bike 09 Sporty xl 1200 Custom...33k + & clickin......
Sportster Owner/Rider since age 72...lol... Rider since Simplex...???
09-xl1200 "C" Vivid Black, Cast wheels w/19" Frt., SE-Stage 1+, X14iEDs...
MicroTach +, Higher wider H-bars, GPS Mt., Mustach bar Hwy. pegs...
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-29-2011, 11:32 AM
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At this point, sounds like cheap insurance. Would definately get the extended warranty.

2 things I would look at:

1) Is the warranty all inclusive?

2) Is the warranty company reputable?

Glad to here that you are on top of the oil, and they have forwarned you of possible coming problems. Hang in there, and hope that it runs long and strong!!!


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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-29-2011, 12:56 PM
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This is an easy one for me. I am a Harley guy who happens to ride a VN750. I have wrenched them for years and I am a HUGE fan of the Evolution motor.

Your 1200 evo motor is just a tiny bit more complicated than a lawn mower engine. Basically.. its 2 lawn motor engines welded together.
I will answer you question directly and then go into details...
If you are anal (or concerned) enough about sending engine oil out for analysis you ABSOLUTELY should go for the extended warranty. Don't take that the wrong way please.

Now.. lets get back to reality land when it comes to an evolution motor.
They have been making them forever. Not alot of changes except for fuel delivery system, and support electronics. The motor is very similar to the 1st evo's. There are some transmission differences.
As long as you make sure you have at least 2 quarts of oil in that motor you won't have to worry about anything. They take 3 quarts. That 3rd quart is just for safe measures and to keep the oil light off.
You can change the oil (or have it changed) when you feel like it. Its not even that necessary to change it. You would have no problems changing it every 3000 miles. Some guys are anal and go 1500 with full synth. Others change their oil at the beginning of the season only. I would go 3000 miles on mine and only use dino oil. Synth is a waste IMHO.
Here is how you trash a Harley evolution motor....
#1. Run it with no oil in it.
#2. Red line it when the motor is ice cold
#3. Miss shifts at extremely high rpms.
Thats about it.
With 14K on your Evolution motor its just starting to break in. The wear they are finding is normal. Evolution motors aren't tight tolerance motors. Thats why they last so long. Thats why they shake and make weird noises and sometimes they sound like the jugs are filled with rocks. The info you are getting is normal stuff that goes on internally on these motors. Most people don't hear about it or care about it. When you dump your oil look in the pan and the oil drain plug. If you see chunks of metal.. you have a problem.
If not... just go riding.
Hope that answers your question.
If it were me.. and it was my bike.. I wouldn't extend the warranty. Especially on a Evo powered sporty but I wrench my own bike. Changing the oil on a sporty is a 10 minute job.
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-29-2011, 10:36 PM
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I gotta agree with jgcable on this.... Your motor is not even broke in yet ... The wear the oil analysis is showing sounds about right because of that.

880 for two years IS high...is that factory extended warranty or an aftermarket firm? They wanted $390 for a 4 year extended warranty for my FJR and I did not go for it. Going on 6 years now and zero problems.. So glad I saved the money.

Use the money for other fun things, and change your oil and filter more often...

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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-31-2011, 05:21 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knifemaker View Post
I gotta agree with jgcable on this.... Your motor is not even broke in yet ... The wear the oil analysis is showing sounds about right because of that.

880 for two years IS high...is that factory extended warranty or an aftermarket firm? They wanted $390 for a 4 year extended warranty for my FJR and I did not go for it. Going on 6 years now and zero problems.. So glad I saved the money.

Use the money for other fun things, and change your oil and filter more often...

KM
I would think the motor is pretty much broke in with over 14k and most all of them on the twistie mountain roads gettin on and off the throttle, gearin up and down, not sure though but seems like it should be... Also with the stage 1 recalibrate lets me go over 7k RPM which is 1.2-1.3k over stock (5.7-5.8k)RPM Rev. limiter, and I've seen it past 7k... I know our VN750 turn much more, but they are a different engine...
And yes, that is HD warranty, not an aftermarket Ins. ...
Like I said I am in no way a fan of extended warranties, but this problem has got me wonderin...
I think I'll call Blackstone Labs. and ask exactly what the universal average means, is that an average for all engines, or is that an average for the 1200 Sportster engine only...??? If its for all engines I may pass, if its for the 1200 Sportster engine only, I may go for the warranty... Just don't know... That $880 is quite a bit of cash to bet on, but I would have to get the work done at a HD dealer and that would be one heck of a bit of cash...lol...
Thanks and have a good one...Old Dog...

Southern Central Tennessee.......
Now on the Dark Side......
Girl's Bike 09 Sporty xl 1200 Custom...33k + & clickin......
Sportster Owner/Rider since age 72...lol... Rider since Simplex...???
09-xl1200 "C" Vivid Black, Cast wheels w/19" Frt., SE-Stage 1+, X14iEDs...
MicroTach +, Higher wider H-bars, GPS Mt., Mustach bar Hwy. pegs...
Viking Shock cutout Saddlebags, Rear Mt. Signal Lt. Kit, Fork Brace...
RoadKing Air Shocks, Mustang Seat, Progressive Fork Springs...
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-31-2011, 05:50 PM
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I'm sure there's a forum somewhere out there with many sportster fans that could confirm what jfcable said. Just like going to a doctor, get a 2nd opinion if you're not sure.

"Show me a man who makes no mistakes, and I'll show you a man who doesn't do things." Theodore Roosevelt."

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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-31-2011, 06:36 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shark88 View Post
I'm sure there's a forum somewhere out there with many sportster fans that could confirm what jfcable said. Just like going to a doctor, get a 2nd opinion if you're not sure.
Yeah, thats kinda what I'm doin, 2nd, 3rd and as many as I can get...lol...
Thanks and have a good one...Old Dog...

Southern Central Tennessee.......
Now on the Dark Side......
Girl's Bike 09 Sporty xl 1200 Custom...33k + & clickin......
Sportster Owner/Rider since age 72...lol... Rider since Simplex...???
09-xl1200 "C" Vivid Black, Cast wheels w/19" Frt., SE-Stage 1+, X14iEDs...
MicroTach +, Higher wider H-bars, GPS Mt., Mustach bar Hwy. pegs...
Viking Shock cutout Saddlebags, Rear Mt. Signal Lt. Kit, Fork Brace...
RoadKing Air Shocks, Mustang Seat, Progressive Fork Springs...
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-31-2011, 08:32 PM
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Well I think it boils down to what you feel comfortable with. Many thought my shunning of the warranty was a bad move... But I think they could easily afford the cash layout.... And I do know many saved thousands on motor work by getting the extended warranty.

Like any kind of insurance, you are basically gambling. My take here is if you do end up needing it at some future point, do you want to regret not opting for it? If you have concerns about your bike and can afford the price, it might be worth the price.

I took the chance, and won. So you gotta ask yourself ( as Dirty Harry would say).........do you feel lucky?

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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-31-2011, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knifemaker View Post
Well I think it boils down to what you feel comfortable with. Many thought my shunning of the warranty was a bad move... But I think they could easily afford the cash layout.... And I do know many saved thousands on motor work by getting the extended warranty.

Like any kind of insurance, you are basically gambling. My take here is if you do end up needing it at some future point, do you want to regret not opting for it? If you have concerns about your bike and can afford the price, it might be worth the price.

I took the chance, and won. So you gotta ask yourself ( as Dirty Harry would say).........do you feel lucky?
Well do you.........?

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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 08-01-2011, 07:08 AM
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"Also with the stage 1 recalibrate lets me go over 7k RPM which is 1.2-1.3k over stock (5.7-5.8k)RPM Rev. limiter, and I've seen it past 7k... "

Do you think that running the engine over the design Rev Limit could cause increased bearing wear?

Also, most warrenties do not cover damage that may result from modifications from stock. Before you purchase an extended warrenty make sure that you are covered.

- Safety First

Paul

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