Hello Group,

It's official; I must replace the head gasket. My question is, do I need to pull the engine to do this job? Any special advice? I am going to order a gasket kit so I have everything.

Problem: steady drip from the front of the front cylinder, behind the radiator.

Thanks guys,
Adam
'85 VN700

I hate to be the one to tell you this, You have to pull the engine to get the heads off. Another bad note for you, Kawasaki doesn't sell gasket sets anymore. I tried to get one from Ron Ayers and got an e-mail telling me they were no longer available. You might want to pull your fuel tank and make sure the fluid isn't coming from one of the hoses at the thermostat housing.

Couldnt he get a gasket kit from the dealer??.

Ron Ayers is a dealer.

Well, this is truly bad news indeed. I am looking at Kawasaki’s website right now and comparing the part numbers to that of ron ayars and to add to the complications, my vn700 actually has a different head gasket than vn750's. The chances of me finding a head gasket made for an engine only produced one year, 21 years ago, only adds to the problem. I will make several phone calls tomorrow and update you on the situation.

New questions: What are my options? Has anyone used oil stop leak additives with success? Any other fancy methods of getting a gasket to stop leaking? Doesn't have to be perfect. As always, thanks for your time guys.

Adam

I wouldn't recommend "stop leak" products...based on my experience if they work, they only work temporarily and the same gunk that sticks in the hole in the gasket sticks everywhere else too. So not only do you have to still replace the gasket, but now you have a huge mess to clean up too.

You could buy gasket material and make your own. I guess that would mean you'd have to have a pattern or good gasket to trace though.

It's a long shot but you could just try a bunch of different parts suppliers and hope one has 'em in stock. Might get lucky.

Try your local auto parts stores, sometimes they know people that make gaskets. I know you can buy a gasket cutting kit, and the gasket material.

I would not recomend making your own Head gasket. As a mechanic by trade the head gasket is the most important and ususlly made with a metal lip on them to protect them from the compression and fire in a cylender. I haven't seen a 750 head gasket, but I have seen automotive gaskets made of metal or graphite covered matereal. With 10 to 1 or so compression you will probabley blow away the head gasket if you use the roll type.

The head gasket for our bikes is metal. It has a real fine coating of something. I don't think you could make one.

The head gasket for our bikes is metal. It has a real fine coating of something. I don't think you could make one.

OH. Nevermind.

Wait! what about JB Weld? :pepper:

Ok guys, what about cleaning the area with carb cleaner and then applying a high temperature silicone. Do you think that would hold the leak? I am running out of options here.

Adam

jb weld ohhh i do not like that idea. Now why the hell did they stop making the head gasket? The only thing i can suggest is see if you can find someone on the net that makes gaskets. they may have you trace the pattern on paper and send it to them or something.

I am almost certain you can get custom gaskets made, b/c you can adjust your compression ratio by this gasket. see if you can also find out the thickness. I know in my jeep i can gain an quite a bit in compression from adjusting the thickness. IIRC i can go from a 8.5:1 to 9.25:1 just with a gasket

Bike Bandit lists the proper head gasket on their website for $25.87 plus shipping.
http://houseofmotorcycles.bikebandit.com/partsbandit/oem_schematic_view~schem_dept_id~283747~section_de pt_id~1~section_dept_name~OEM+%28Stock%29+Parts~de pt_type_id~2~model_dept_year~1985~model_dept_mfr~K awasaki~model_dept_id~283565~model_dept_name~VULCA N+700%28VN700A1%29US.asp
I know this is a long URL but that is the reference to the gasket. Good luck.

Thank you so much sky rider! I will now reconsider pulling the engine instead of trying to seal the leak from the outside.

Adam

Question.

On the front of the front cylinder, (directly behind the radiator) there is a breather hose that comes out of the cylinder head. Just below that hose is a hole that approximately 6-7mm in diameter. The hole is just above the head gasket. I can't tell, but the oil may be leaking out of that hole and not out the gasket. Does anyone know what that hole's purpose is? Would it be possible for oil to be leaking from there? :BLAM:

Thanks,
Adam
'85 VN700A :carryflag

www.ronayers.com has it a little cheaper, but shipping may be more....


Product Qty Price
11004-1134 GASKET-HEAD 1 $22.06

The microfiche has a breather joint listed for the 700 and a breather fitting for the 750 both with the same actual part number. I'm not sure what it is for but I suspect it may be part of the PCV system or something similar. I will have to check in the manuals to be sure. If it is part of the PCV system, oil could come from there.
I just got to thinking, have you checked other indicators of a blown head gasket? Is there coolant in the oil and vice versa? Are the front cylinder plugs oil fouled? Believe me, if you don't have to, don't pull the engine. It's not difficult but there are myriad fasteners, washers, wires, cables, connectors, hoses, etc to keep track of on top of the fact that even with the engine out of the bike, once you get the head covers off, space is still at a premium. The surge tank is a major PITN once it becomes time to reinstall the engine.
If you do pull the engine, make sure you have at least the Clymer's shop manual and if possible the Kawasaki manual as well as they fill in for each other's weak points. I used both heavily while reasseblming my engine. I recommend the Clymer's for pulling the engine as it is much more detailed in the procedure than the Kaw manual.
One other thing, beware of the engine when pulling it. Mine wouldn't come out of the frame even with all the bolts and other things removed. It hung in there even after the jack was lowered and came out suddenly once it decided to go. Unfortunatly, my knee was under it and that was not pleasant!!!!!! :( It may stick in the frame. Just make sure you keep the jack under it so it doesn't fall far if it gets stuck and keep your body appendages well clear.

Here is a photo. Yes, the hose is basically a PCV exit into the main air duct. That is not leaking though, I thought it was originally and I replaced that hose and used a stepped clamp instead of the crappy pinch clamp it came with. This is not source of the leak though. The hole I was referring to is visible in this photo. It's just above the head gasket. I can't tell if oil is coming out of the hole or out of the head gasket just below the hole. My question is, does anyone know what this hole is? What does it lead to? Could oil leak from it? Is something supposed to be in the hole that maybe fell out?

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g234/bcjoker04/06_07_25_01014LargeWebview.jpg

Great photo. I can see where the hole is on my bike, but that's about all. With the radiator there, I'm lucky I can see it at all. While I was looking in the general direction, I noticed a lot of oily crud on the breather hose. Which means that it is probably leaking, but almost too hard to access that I'm not worrying about it. Don't know what the hole is, but seeing how you got a decent pic, can you shine a flashlight in it? Can you stick a wire in there and see how deep it goes? Try cleaning it out real good, then stuff some paper towel in it and run the engine. Pull the towel out and see if you've got fresh oil. That's pretty much the only advice I can give.

I'm not, by any means, an expert, but sometimes the obvious can be hidden and exposed by a "dummy". Is your oil at the proper level? Maybe an overfilled crankcase will cause oil to spew out this hole???

Hello Group,

Ok, here is what I did…

I took a bit of advice from all of you and so far I have had good results. I lowered my oil level to about 1/8” under the max fill line. I checked the coolant and oil, no trace of cross contamination. Also, I never could conclusively decide if the oil was leaking from the hole (see picture above) or the head gasket. Total parts to replace the head gasket were around 100 dollars and I figured the time commitment would be one whole weekend so that option was a last resort for me. I decided to only remove the radiator and do a good JB Weld job on the hole and gasket area around the leak to see if that would work. I figured I really didn’t have anything to loose by doing this, I could re-drill the hole out and I could remove the JB Weld if I ever decided to replace the head gasket. So I took my Dremel and grinded off all the paint around the whole area around the leak. I then cleaned the area thoroughly with brake cleaner and soap and water. Then I mixed the JB Weld, let it sit for 30 minutes (its 110 degrees here) and then carefully applied it to the area. I covered the exposed hole and the area around the head gasket that was leaking. As it turns out, 30 minutes was not long enough for the JB Weld to get thick enough to stay in place. I spent 20 minutes reshaping the JB Weld and after I finally quit, it still ran a bit. But it worked; it just doesn’t look as pretty as it originally did. Once the JB Weld was dry, I sprayed the area down with flat black rustolient spray paint to protect the area and make it blend back in with the engine. I have included a picture below; you can compare it to the previous picture I posted. I reassembled the bike about an hour ago, filled it back up with coolant and started her up. I let her run for about 15 minutes and drove her around the parking lot, allowing her to get up to full operating temperature. I checked all over the engine, not one leak. Everything seems to be working fine. I will report back after a few hundred miles as to any leaks or cross contamination in the oil or coolant. If this happens, I will replace the head gasket. As for now, I am very happy with my much easier fix. Wish me good luck that it continues to work and as always, thank you all for your time and support. This is a great group.

Adam

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g234/bcjoker04/06_07_30_01001LargeWebview.jpg

A word of caution. On my first car the transmission fluid would leak out of a tube that came to the top of the engine. I finally sealed it off. Anybody wanna guess what happened?

Anybody wanna guess what happened?

I'll guess ya blew a seal, as it was probably a vent line ya plugged.

Nope. A couple of weeks later, while I was going home via the pig trail (the arkansas dragon, so to speak), I started feeling fluid on my leg. I pulled over, cut the tubes on my aftermarket oil pressure gauge, and sealed them up good. Drove another 10 or so hard miles, and started getting wet again. Looked at the oil, it was reddish. Traced the oil to the speedometer cable. I had been heating up my trans so much, and the pressure couldn't escape, so it pushed the oil up the speedometer cable. Darndest thing. I could just see the maintenance guys trying to figure that one out...

Thank you for the word of caution.

The book, diagrams online, or anyone on this site can identify the purpose of that hole so I am hoping it's not that important. I drove to work this morning, 25 miles; everything works perfectly so far.... Knock on wood.

Adam

The hole probably isn't anything. It's probably like those other nodules on the engine that look like they are meant for something

Could be anything from an access hole that was needed for some type of internal machining, then plugged, or some type of expansion/shrinkage chamber for when the head was cooling after it's cast.
I can't really see behind the rad enough to get a good look on mine.
Just keep an eye on things for awhile, and hopefully all will be fine !

The whole you plugged is the drain for your spark plug retainer (that's what Clymer manual calls it). I was getting oil out of mine and it ended up being the inner O-ring. Any water you get in around the spark plug could cause a misfire. My weekend project was tearing my engine down to find and fix my leak, I could have fixed it by just pulling the spark plug and retainer.

The whole you plugged is the drain for your spark plug retainer (that's what Clymer manual calls it). I was getting oil out of mine and it ended up being the inner O-ring. Any water you get in around the spark plug could cause a misfire. My weekend project was tearing my engine down to find and fix my leak, I could have fixed it by just pulling the spark plug and retainer.

Damn wwmkwood, where were you a few months ago, lol! So as you have all read, I basically did a JB Weld job on the area where oil was leaking, which I now know was out of the spark plug retainer drain hole. This seemed to do the job at first. It was leaking oil very bad and then the leak was gone. Until today, I had been highly concerned that my coolant and/or oil would become cross contaminated since I figured it was still a head gasket leak.

A few days after I did the JB fix, I noticed my bike was leaking oil again. This time not nearly as bad. It looked as thought the head gasket was leaking again, only this time more to the left side of the engine. A few weeks went buy when I suddenly realized that the oil was coming from the "spark plug retainer". It was filling up with oil and the only time it would leak out is when I put the bike on its side stand. (Leaning the bike over would essentially “pour” the oil out of the retainer) I ordered new o-rings for both retainers and after installing them, my bike doesn't leak a single drop.

I THOUGHT this was a second leak, in addition to the head gasket, until today. Now that I read your post, I know that I do NOT have a head gasket leak, which puts my mind at ease. I am also VERY happy that I did not spend a weekend and a couple hundred dollars pulling my engine and tearing it apart to fix a perfectly good head gasket. I am once again confident that my bike is in good mechanical condition. Thank you for the piece of mind!

Moral of the story: If your engine is leaking oil, check the o-rings on the two "spark plug retainers"! This is a super cheap fix and it couldn't be easier to do either! www.bikebandit.com sells them for a couple bucks.

Adam
'85 VN700 :motorcycl

WOW! I started to think that Wormwood was pulling a cegodsey, but it all makes sense. This is something I'll have to stick in the back of my brain somewhere, if it ever comes up again.

I'm glad I figured your problem out. I rode my bike to work today, just walked out to the parking lot and looked at all of the oil dripping off the back of my engine. Guess what? The rear head has the same hole and it will leak oil just as fast as the front one does.