engine misses under load - Page 2 - Kawasaki Vulcan 750 Forum : Kawasaki VN750 Forums
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Where does this wire go?
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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-20-2009, 07:40 PM
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glad to know it works for you now... I wasn't sure how the 2 spark plugs worked on these, I know Nissan used to use 2 plugs per cylinder one was intake and one was exhaust... the exhaust one fire just after the exhaust valve closed to help burn any excess fuel

Last edited by slimvulcanrider; 08-22-2009 at 10:03 AM.
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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-20-2009, 11:57 PM
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To me what Lance said makes the most sense to me. One coil - two wires, spark would have to reach the plugs at the same time and that would be a little before TDC on the compression stroke. At less thatís what I'm thinking.



2000 VN750
gray and black
13,265 when I picked it up


Relocated R/R
Marbled
Relayed coils
Volt meter (Relayed)
Blue accent lighting
Iridium plugs
Turn signal buzzer
Highway pegs
Heated grips
Fork bag
Auburn leather saddle bags
Clock
Replaced front side reflectors with LED reflectors
Added LED lights to bottom of front tubes
Polished front tubes
Sylvania H4ST
DEKA MF AGM ETX15L
Regapped pickups to snug .020
TOC ACCT springs

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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-21-2009, 12:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slimvulcanrider View Post
that doesn't sound right...but my guess is becasue one side burns fuel and the other burns exhaust gases...some one else jump in on this one plz
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Originally Posted by Reiki3 View Post
Slim or anybody else, just how does the two plugs per cylinder work? I thought they both fired at the same time, both for fuel. If one is for fuel and one for exhaust, which one is which. Does marbeling come into play here at all?
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Originally Posted by slimvulcanrider View Post
glad to know it works for you now... I wasn't sure how the 2 spark plugs worked on these, I know Nissan used to use 2 plugs per cylinder one was intake and one was exhaust... the exhaust one fire just before the exhaust valve opened to help burn any excess fuel
Jeez slim, I thought you were just "funnin'" him in the first post you made. I`ll be the first to admit that I don`t know a lot about Nissan or any other Japanese cars, but I have never heard of this second spark to burn the exhaust gases. I thought that the catalytic converter was supposed to take care of any unburned hydrocarbons in the exhaust system.

My understanding of having two spark plugs per cylinder, is that they both fire at the same time to get a more complete burn of the fuel, and more power and efficiency.

Do you know of a link anywhere that discusses this process that Nissan used or uses? It sounds "off" to me.

Gordon

1991 VN 750 -"Cosmic Lady" or "Bad Girl"?
Purchased May 16, 2008
Approx.19,300km (12,000 miles)

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Last edited by OlHossCanada; 08-21-2009 at 12:49 AM.
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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-22-2009, 09:23 AM
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Jeez slim, I thought you were just "funnin'" him in the first post you made. I`ll be the first to admit that I don`t know a lot about Nissan or any other Japanese cars, but I have never heard of this second spark to burn the exhaust gases. I thought that the catalytic converter was supposed to take care of any unburned hydrocarbons in the exhaust system.

My understanding of having two spark plugs per cylinder, is that they both fire at the same time to get a more complete burn of the fuel, and more power and efficiency.

Do you know of a link anywhere that discusses this process that Nissan used or uses? It sounds "off" to me.
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Not sure where to look for info that supports my claims other than NAPA... look up a 1986 Nissan Pickup with the 4 cylinder engine. there will be 2 spark plug numbers, one is for intake and one is labeled exhaust. I used to ask how this worked as well, because I too thought that the two spark plugs would fire at the same time, to cause a ore efficient burn, and the catalytic converter would do the rest. The afterburn spark theory is that they could reduce eissions even further if the raw unused gas was burned before the cat.
Now on our bikes I have no clue why they have 4 plugs... it seams to me that two would be just fine.

I am going to do a little bit ore research into this on the bikes, because I never heard of running 2 sparkplugs per cylinder for combustion burn. I'll report y findings back here:

UPDATE: Ford used the dual spark in the mid 90's Rangers... the Ranger's system fires both intake and exhaust at the same time to achieve ah otter burn, and supposedly higher engine revs. Nissan used there system like I mentioned above. I also found more but its going to take e a while to sift through it all and make scene of it

Last edited by slimvulcanrider; 08-22-2009 at 09:58 AM. Reason: added more info
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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-22-2009, 09:46 AM
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What if, a person was to take a run and note how it ran and sounded. Then did the same run again, only pull both left side plug wires off and see if there was a difference. Then do the same thing with the right side. You might only get to the end of the driveway and know. I've seen cutaways of a car motors showing the cycle of the vales and plug firing. Anyone seen one for the vn750? That might tell the story.



2000 VN750
gray and black
13,265 when I picked it up


Relocated R/R
Marbled
Relayed coils
Volt meter (Relayed)
Blue accent lighting
Iridium plugs
Turn signal buzzer
Highway pegs
Heated grips
Fork bag
Auburn leather saddle bags
Clock
Replaced front side reflectors with LED reflectors
Added LED lights to bottom of front tubes
Polished front tubes
Sylvania H4ST
DEKA MF AGM ETX15L
Regapped pickups to snug .020
TOC ACCT springs


Last edited by Reiki3; 08-22-2009 at 09:56 AM.
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post #16 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-22-2009, 10:05 AM
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What if, a person was to take a run and note how it ran and sounded. Then did the same run again, only pull both left side plug wires off and see if there was a difference. Then do the same thing with the right side. You might only get to the end of the driveway and know. I've seen cutaways of a car motors showing the cycle of the vales and plug firing. Anyone seen one for the vn750? That might tell the story.
I was looking for just that same info myself. Your proposed ride sounds good though...
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post #17 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-22-2009, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
pull both left side plug wires off and see if there was a difference
That might be an interesting test. Only remember to ground the pulled plug wires by some means or the bike won't run at all.

I believe that starting the flame front at two points gives faster burning as the flame front area then grows faster at the beginning of the combustion. At least that is my common sense deduction. That should be a good thing at higher revs.
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post #18 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-22-2009, 07:34 PM
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Ford and Nissan did make a 4 cylinder with 2 plugs per cylinder. The plug wires for the same cylinder came from different coil packs on the Ford and and eight plug distributer cap was used on the older Nissan. On the Ford the first plug fired around 10 degrees BTDC the second one fired a few degrees ATDC on the power stroke. It was nicknamed the "suck me blow me" Head.

The reason our bikes have two plugs plugs is so the air /fuel mixture can burn twice as fast and more completely than with one plug. With one plug the the burn starts at the plug side then has to travel to the other side. With two plugs the burn starts at both plugs equaly and burns to the center in half the time of one plug.

As a result you get more power and a quicker reving engine.


85 VN700 "Old Yella"

REBUILT ENGINE
CUSTOM PAINT
VANCE & HINES CRUZERS
EAR SHAVED AND RE-JETTED W/K&N'S
DUNLOP ELITE K591 FRONT & REAR
VOLTMETER
SYNTHETIC BRAKE FLUID
SYNTHETIC OIL & GEAR LUBE
PLEXISTAR 2 WINDSHIELD
SPLINES LUBED
ACCT'S GREASED W/TOC SPRINGS
COASTERD
LEATHER SADDLE BAGS
LEATHER TOOL AND ROLL BAG
PICKUP COILS GAPPED AT .018"
NGK CAP, WIRES, IRIDUMS
BARNETT FRICTION PLATES & SPRINGS
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ORIGINAL STATOR & R/R 14.5v
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Last edited by lance328; 08-22-2009 at 08:59 PM.
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post #19 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-22-2009, 08:33 PM
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That sounds good Lance (as usual). I think after reading that, I decided to regap my pickup coils instead of trying that test I was thinking about with the plugs.



2000 VN750
gray and black
13,265 when I picked it up


Relocated R/R
Marbled
Relayed coils
Volt meter (Relayed)
Blue accent lighting
Iridium plugs
Turn signal buzzer
Highway pegs
Heated grips
Fork bag
Auburn leather saddle bags
Clock
Replaced front side reflectors with LED reflectors
Added LED lights to bottom of front tubes
Polished front tubes
Sylvania H4ST
DEKA MF AGM ETX15L
Regapped pickups to snug .020
TOC ACCT springs

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post #20 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-22-2009, 09:02 PM
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You should see a difference in throttle response after gapping the pickup coils.


85 VN700 "Old Yella"

REBUILT ENGINE
CUSTOM PAINT
VANCE & HINES CRUZERS
EAR SHAVED AND RE-JETTED W/K&N'S
DUNLOP ELITE K591 FRONT & REAR
VOLTMETER
SYNTHETIC BRAKE FLUID
SYNTHETIC OIL & GEAR LUBE
PLEXISTAR 2 WINDSHIELD
SPLINES LUBED
ACCT'S GREASED W/TOC SPRINGS
COASTERD
LEATHER SADDLE BAGS
LEATHER TOOL AND ROLL BAG
PICKUP COILS GAPPED AT .018"
NGK CAP, WIRES, IRIDUMS
BARNETT FRICTION PLATES & SPRINGS
CUSTOM GRIPS, MIRRORS, LEVERS
ORIGINAL STATOR & R/R 14.5v
DEKA MF AGM ETX15L

Best Auto/Moto Insurance | Motorcycle Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote
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